The face of hip-hop is changing; it’s diversifying; opening up new conversations and life experiences into the genre. One newcomer to the field is Tobias Hess, aka Tobias For Now, who was featured at just 16-years-old as “an unlikely rapper”, due to the fact as he explains "I’m very skinny, very obviously Jewish, I wear goofy clothing," and so "My life experiences may not directly pertain to what hip-hop is generally known to be.” Well, a year and a half on from that introduction, and the now 17-year-old artist has served up his second EP, titled tobie, which follows the eleven-track JAZZ/SEX/SOUP from which we chose ‘Typhoon’ as a List Pick.

In the description of the EP’s SoundCloud stream, Hess shares a little piece of biographical context: “in april 2014 i texted my friend “I’m gay.” I was so afraid of those words that I couldn’t look at her for days. I’m still looking away.” These newest tracks represent where this young artist is now in his personal journey, but outside of that diarist approach, they also represent TFN’s ever-expanding stylistic horizons. Opening track ‘faggot.’ combines a guitar riff lifted from a Porches song alongside looped and warped samples of the artist himself; the combination creating the drama of Frank Ocean with the playfulness of Hess. Then there’s ‘give me a reason!’ which is reminiscent of BROCKHAMPTON'S ‘LAMB’ with that drifting melody and wandering vocals that explodes into frantic instrumentation and building emotion. Then there’s the hooky affair that is ‘floating.’, with disco samples and intricate strings; this is arguably where TFN hits his rhythmic stride with just over a minute of dextrous rap. To finish, we have the only non-draft of the EP (read on to see what Hess means by “draft”), which is ‘trying...’, a slower-paced single of alt-rock drums and softly plucked acoustic guitar that presents yet another side of this teenager’s creativity. What the tobie EP does is convey Tobias For Now’s existence outside of genre labels and boundaries, not because he has a point to prove, but because he’s out here, doing this for himself and no one else.

With two EPs and a generous offering of tracks online, we wanted to catch up with the Los Angeles musician to talk about his new EP, favourite artists, discovering his talent, sexuality, being a teenager and plans for the future.

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TMR: You recently shared your second EP online, although three of the tracks are labelled as “drafts”. Is there a next stage for those?

tobie was a really intense and emotional project. It took a lot out of me. And throughout the whole process, I felt like “this is where I am right now”. This is a time capsule of where I am in terms of my identity and sexuality. So labeling them as “drafts” felt kind of poetic. It’s not really saying that they’re unfinished, but that where I am in my life is unfinished. The last song, which is not labelled draft, is no more finished or unfinished sonically than the rest, I just thought it would be nice to have that be declared as a finished idea because ‘trying’ is the conclusion to the project and shows me finding some acceptance.

It’s funny that you ask that though because I was talking with someone recently and we started toying with the idea of having ‘give me a reason!’ re-produced to make it a little bit more, I don't know, hard/current(?) So in that case, this current version would actually be a draft!

TMR: The overall production is smoother and perhaps more polished than previous EP, JAZZ/SEX/SOUP, is that something you’ve been working on in the past year?

Yes, not intentionally though. I’ve been just working on my craft and getting my music to sound as true and moving as possible. I’m really proud of JAZZ/SEX/SOUP, but there’s no comparison in my opinion. tobie is infinitely more polished, interesting and unique. I’m really, really proud of it.

TMR: One of your new tracks has quite a controversial title: ‘faggot.’ What’s the story behind that track?

That song stemmed from a sample of myself actually! I made a song called ‘fuq boi’ where I was basically just having fun and roasting some people that I see around who fit that title. And that song has a line that says, “why you say faggot? / when you just a faggot!” And the way I sung was really high pitched and cool, so I took that audio and looped it. Then I found that guitar from a Porches song [‘Skinny Trees’] and it really just came together so quickly. I wrote the lyrics for the first part in one sitting, almost no stopping, just like a freestyle and it really poured out of me. The chorus, that big explosion, just says ‘faggot’ over and over again using the sample of my voice. So it made sense for the song to be named ‘faggot’. It also made sense in the context of the album, because I knew I would be starting somewhere, maybe ashamed and angry, and hopefully over four songs, finding some peace. So what better way to start then with a slur that almost every lgbtq+ person has a story about?

I know it’s triggering, and some people have spoken to me about it. But I don't make my music assuming people will hear it . . . or at least anyone I don’t know, maybe that’s changing. But, I just do what feels right for me. That being said, when straight people refer to the song, my body tenses a bit, but what can I do? I named the song that. And even that scenario is interesting and prompts a dialogue.



TMR: In fact, throughout all of your songs in the two EPs, you’re unafraid of utilising words that in the wrong context would be viewed as offensive by many in the queer community. Is this your way of flipping the stereotype of a Hip-Hop artist?

Yes, definitely! But again, I don’t assume that the music I make, or words I use will have an impact - I’m kind of just making music in my bedroom. So I don't have grand political ambitions. I just know that when I use those words in defiance or empowerment, it feels good . . . it feels healing. So maybe it's selfish, but it stems from my own feelings.

TMR: With acts coming up like yourself, Kevin Abstract, Jay Boogie, Shamir, there seems to be a new discourse in Hip-Hop that isn’t one of the heterosexual male. In your opinion, does it feel as though things in the genre and wider music industry are beginning to change?

Yes! I mean, I think society is changing and we’re beginning to view everything on a wider spectrum, so it makes sense that our art and culture would reflect that. The best thing though is that you can now be a queer artist as well as just an artist who happens to be queer. Our ability to see queer people as full humans is growing, and I think that’s a lot more inviting to both listeners and artists, ‘cause now, if you’re a gay rapper for instance, you don’t have to go hard on every song proving your manhood and your humanity and that you have sex with a million dudes, you can talk about anything and the whole “I like people of the same gender” can be just an interesting aspect. I think that BROCKHAMPTON and Tyler have changed everything. And I’m just here to participate in that change and hopefully widen it, maybe bring some of the radicalism in queer identity to the music and culture.

TMR: Is there anything in particular you’d like to see happen to improve the music world in the next few years?

I’m just excited for labels (not record labels, like, how we define things) to erode. Definitely with genres, the lines between, hip hop, rock, pop, r&b, they’re pretty negligible. And also with singers, with rappers, with artists, performers, all of these are names that bring certain boxes. Kanye talked about that for years and everyone thought he was crazy. But we should all have the freedom to experiment and make art in any capacity, in any way we want. I also hear the hip hop traditionalists that see the genre as sacred and untouchable, and they want to pay respects to those that have come before. And I would never argue with that, especially as a white male interacting with a black art form, but at the same time, I think those labels we set for our art, only hurt our expression, experimentation and freedom. That’s why I don't really call my music rap or hip hop, because if I did that, I would be interacting with a certain history and culture that means so much to so many people. That’s something I struggling with though. Because I want to push boundaries and respect history and culture. If anyone has any answer, let me know!



TMR: Coming back to your music, readers at TMR would have first heard of you through the track ‘Typhoon’, which was a theme throughout JAZZ/SEX/SOUP. What’s the metaphor or meaning of 'Typhoon'?

A lot of my lyrics are very subconscious, so I’ll write it, record it and still not be able to totally verbalize what it is myself. Which I think is awesome. If I had to give it some sense of meaning, it would be just the feeling of being overwhelmed. The typhoon of feelings that comes with growing up and life and discovery. It’s awe really. I feel it often.

TMR: Another stand-out track has to be ‘The Gay Kanye’, where did the idea for that one come from? Is Kanye West an artist that has had an impact on you creatively?

Wow thanks! I made that song, and it was one of my forays into “I’m gay, I don't give a fuck!” kind of music. So that song just breathes a certain bravado. And Kanye represents that confidence and craze. Kanye is in everything I do, he’s the original in so many respects. I look up to him and his expression profoundly. So I just wanted to pay respects to him.

TMR: Are there any rappers, singers, songwriters, producers, video directors, artists from other disciplines that you’d love to work with one day?

I’ve been hitting up BROCKHAMPTON for the entirety of my life it feels like. I would love to work with them and I feel like we’re really on the same wave with what we’re trying to do. So inspired by their work. Tyler as well - I used to really loathe Odd Future - but Flower Boy and how he’s progressed just floored me. That’s my favorite album at the moment.

Jesse Rutherford I’ve been listening to a lot. I want to work with more DIY or pop acts. Gabriel Black is a new artist I’ve loved. Tripped Red is the best, and wasn’t prepared to become a full on super fan for him. I’m also intrigued by this new bedroom pop movement so Clairo and Gus Dapperton are on my mind.

TMR: I read that you were first introduced to computer-based music composition by your teacher at just ten-years-old, but when did Hip-Hop first become a factor in your life?

I got into Hip Hop at my summer camp (shouts to Camp Tawonga). All of the counselors were these woke, Bay Area dudes who were playing 2pac, Atmosphere, Brother Ali, and it just hit me how beautiful and complex this music is. We also started playing these freestyle games that I had a certain knack for, and that became my party trick. I lost that ability a bit, but Hip Hop stayed with me and I told everyone I was gonna be a rapper. No one believed me (they shouldn’t have), but I don't know, I guess I was unnecessarily confident and stuck with it for over five years and make it my own. Rap though is just a way to communicate. So I look at it like with each song I can sing, or rap, or talk, whatever - I just want to communicate. So I don't see myself as much of rapper, it’s just one form of communication.



TMR: I assume like most people these days, and especially teenagers, you listen to lots of different kinds of music. Do you have any favourite artists/bands at the moment?

Yes! I’ve been listening to a crazy mix, a lot of non-Hip-Hop stuff lately. Mainly DIY rock like Japanese Breakfast, Jay Som, Pinegrove (bummed about the recent news with them so taking a pause) and Jesse Rutherford. There’s this new artist Gabriel Black, who just blows me away, with his flow and song writing. Matt Martians as well. SAKIMA has been a supporter from really early and his video for ‘Daddy’ makes me cry and dance at the same time, it’s so sick!

TMR: Speaking of being a teenager and having access to so much music and resources via the Internet, have you found that those of your generation are trying their hand at things like music production, songwriting or other creative pursuits?

Yes, definitely. Especially in L.A. Everyone's an artist, be it a designer, producer, rapper, singer, photographer, painter - everyone. Part of me gets exhausted, and there’s a sense of competition in the air because everyone is working so hard, but then I remind myself that everyone expressing themselves is a beautiful thing and we can all rise together. When it is for expression and not clout, of course.

TMR: Unbelievably considering your musical talents and originality, you’re still in high school, what’s the plan after you graduate?

Uhhhhh. . . may have to get back to you on that haha! I'm applying to college now, some for writing, some for music. There’s a music school at NYU where a lot of artists I admire are coming from and my best friend Jasper Harris currently attends, so that may indeed be the move, if I get in. Maybe I’ll just stay in L.A. and work in a bookstore and meet a nice Jewish boy… who knows!? But music is the priority right now. I feel things happening with it that are really exciting.

TMR: Will there be more new music from the Tobias For Now project in the new year?

Yes! Hopefully. I feel some incredible things starting to percolate and I would love to just watch things grow and collaborate with other artists that I admire. I’m really proud of this EP, so right now I’m putting together some videos and promo stuff for that. I just want that EP to grow and touch people and hopefully the next thing will roll off that in no time. Thank you so much for highlighting my work and giving me a platform. It means so much having this support.



-Hannah Thacker